Kevin Sousa’s FORM Method: The Facebook Chat Strategy Behind Fifty Three Sign-Ups in a Month

A stranger accepts your friend request, and before you’ve said a single word back, the message arrives. Have you heard of this? Want my link? Kevin Sousa gets messages exactly like that constantly, and he says no every time, not because he’s uninterested in opportunities, but because the person on the other end skipped every step that would have made him actually want to click. Kevin is fifty eight, calls himself old school, and has quietly built one of the most consistent free-traffic recruiting results in the room by doing almost the opposite of that stranger’s approach.

In one focused month chatting with strangers on Facebook, he sponsored fifty three people into his business, the overwhelming majority of them from conversations that started exactly the way that stranger’s didn’t. Slow. Genuinely curious. Led by a simple four-part framework he’s used online for years.

What’s actually wrong with sending your link the moment someone shows interest?

Kevin’s read on why most people fail at this is specific. They get one flicker of interest, somebody comments on a post or asks what they do, and they hand over a link in the same breath. He compares his own approach to a company president interviewing candidates for a leadership role rather than chasing them down the street. Screen for the right fit first. Hand over information second. The instant someone shows a spark of curiosity and you shove a link at them, you’ve told them, without meaning to, exactly how desperate you are for this to work. Desperation is easy to sense through a screen. It reads the same there as it does across a table.

This isn’t a strategy that requires an existing list or years of relationships either, which is the objection most people raise. Kevin’s example conversation starts with someone he’d been Facebook friends with for two years but had never actually spoken to. A total stranger, in practical terms. The framework works whether you know somebody or not, because it isn’t built on familiarity. It’s built on genuine curiosity about the person in front of you.

What is the FORM method, and why does it actually work?

Kevin keeps himself on track in every conversation using an acronym. Family, occupation, recreation, and money, or message. He doesn’t run through it in order and he doesn’t treat it like a script. The point isn’t the four categories themselves, it’s what happens underneath them. If all you do is ask about somebody’s job, their kids, and their weekend without ever answering the same questions about yourself, you’re conducting an interrogation, and people feel the difference between a real conversation and being worked. So for every question he asks, Kevin shares something back, a detail about his own family or his own weekend, matching the other person rather than extracting information from them.

He leans on an old idea for this, one he picked up decades before Facebook existed and simply carried online. “Becoming genuinely interested in someone else.” It sounds almost too simple to be a strategy, and that’s exactly why most people skip past it looking for a shortcut instead.

How do you actually know it’s time to send the link?

This is the piece Kevin says most people get wrong, and it isn’t a script, it’s a felt signal. He doesn’t send a link the moment someone says they’re curious. Curious isn’t a yes, so he asks one more question rather than reading the person’s mind, and he waits until they say so themselves. He waits until he can feel, in an almost physical way, that both people in the conversation have opened up: a shared value surfaces, gets confirmed back, and something in the exchange shifts. Only then does the link go out. In the walkthrough he gives, that whole arc, a stranger’s first comment on an old post to a completed sign-up, took less than three hours, paced the entire way by that felt sense of readiness rather than by urgency.

You will be able to give links to people on a virtually unlimited basis when it becomes all about them.

That’s not a soft sentiment tacked onto the end of a sales technique. It’s the actual mechanism. Chase people and you repel them. Get genuinely curious about whoever is in front of you, and be willing to walk away if there’s no real fit, and the same conversation that used to feel like begging starts to feel more like an interview you’re conducting, calmly, on your own terms. It also happens to be a lot easier on you. Treating each new conversation like it might be your last prospect on earth is exhausting. Treating it like one of many, with nothing to prove and no reason to rush, is how Kevin’s kept doing this for years without burning out on it.

The full session walks through Kevin’s exact chat, word for word, along with what he does once somebody actually says yes. Watch it in full, free, when you Create your free account.

The full session transcript follows below.

Transcript

Hey, welcome guys. Here we are. We're with Kevin Sousa. Kevin is an amazing guy.

I don't know how many of you know him already. I bet a bunch of you do. Some of you may already be connected to him on social media. But Kevin has achieved a really significant result.

In November of last year, Kevin recruited, and I want to make sure I got the number right, 53 people. Is that right? Yes. Yeah, 53 people in a single month using a free traffic strategy.

Actually, two free traffic strategies from what I understand. But we're going to be zeroing in on one because I asked him which one would be the most useful for people to learn first, and he said that the Facebook chat method would be the method to do that. Now, so just to be clear, just so that I understand the numbers before we get into the modeling that we're going to do here in just a minute, did all 53 of those come from Facebook in one way, shape, or form, or did some of them come from something else? Actually, seven of them came from paid advertising.

The other 46. The other 46 came from Facebook. Okay, so 40, still the vast majority came from Facebook, and the few that came from paid advertising, was it solo ads, was it? Yes.

Solo ads, okay. Perfect. And what we'd like to do is we'd like to break down basically a free recruiting, free traffic strategy, and we're probably going to have Kevin do some straight-up teaching later on. Remember, NLP modeling is the core of NLP, and modeling is not copying somebody.

Although, sometimes that's useful if it's not illegal to do it, right? We always want to mind people. I say don't steal people's stuff, but learn what they're doing and replicate it. And at the beginning, replicate it closely using your own story, right?

Using your own story, using your own methods. But modeling is really about getting curious about how someone who's had an amazing result got that result, and it has to do as much with what their mindset is, what their beliefs are, as it is with the actions that we're taking. So we're going to be doing that. We're going to be doing more of modeling right now, and then later on, we may have him do a video where he just straight-up teaches the Facebook chat method as he did it to get the results that he got in November.

And from what I understand is that shortly after November, he had a health issue and some surgery, and he still had a trickle of people coming in, but that was the last time that he had a real big focused push. So we're going to be focusing in on that particular month and what he did during that month to get that result. Is that all right, Kevin? Absolutely.

Absolutely. Okay, fantastic. So with that in mind, here's the structure of what we're looking for. We call it the geo.

We look for goals, evidence, and operations. Okay, operation is what you did, and that's what most people want to teach. But before we get there, we want to go back up into the goals that you've got around it. And so I want to rewind you to right before November 2015, and I want you to go into that moment where you knew it was time to bump up your…

your production. And before we even get into the geo, I'd just like to ask, what was it that triggered it? Like, what told you that it was time to do a big… a big recruiting push?

Well, it had absolutely nothing to do with my personal goals. It had a little… only very little to do with that. The team of affiliates that we work together with, Mike Hobbs is my sponsor in the business, and we work with Paul Hutchings very closely, and some other leaders within our team structure, we decided to have a contest, and the incentive was to win the contest, to see who could, you know, sponsor the most people, get the most points.

We had a point system and kept track of, you know, how many chats we had during the day and where we were with those particular people when we chatted. And so we had a measurable tracking system, which we still do. And I decided… I decided to just go full force with it.

To go full force with it. Yeah. And now, I'm curious, did you win or did… Yes, I did.

You did. All right. Well, that's good. Hang on.

I'm going to put myself to do not disturb here because I'm getting calls coming through. Give me two seconds. All right. There we go.

So, you won the contest, and you came highly recommended, a couple of people recommended you and said that you were very, very good at what you did, but it really came down to a goal focus. And what made it so that you won? What made it so that you wanted to… You wanted to win the contest?

Well, I knew that that was one of my strengths, chatting. And here's why. If you guys look at me, I'll be 58 years old at the end of this year. I'm old school, okay?

And so, however, I'm one of the few people my age who are also very well versed online. Right. And so, I took a lot of my old school training. Okay.

And applied it online, which is what I've been doing ever since I got online to create income. And that's all I did was just simply applied old school principles and practices to what we're doing in Facebook, and it works like a charm. Okay. So, for you, it was just a place where you knew you were strong, and you knew you could win the contest.

I knew I had a good chance. You knew you had a good chance, but now some people would know they have a good chance of winning, and they wouldn't do anything. So, like, I want you to go back into that moment and just think, what was it that tipped you to the edge and said, I'm going to do this. It's my time.

You know, there's just something inside of me that says, you can do this. Just do it. Just do it. And so, I, in essence, just said to myself, you can do this.

Just do it. Just do it. Just do it. Yeah.

That same month, I made a video entitled, Just Do It. Just do it. And that was it. And so, there you are.

Okay. So, there you are. And there was no other outside means that was motivating you. It was just time to go do it.

That's right. Yeah. Okay. So, there you are.

It's time. You're just going to do it. Now, I want you to go back to that moment right at the beginning of the month of November, and you were setting up your goals, right? And so, we're not down into even the chat method yet.

We're just big goals. Did you have a goal firmly in mind, or did the goal kind of evolve as you went? Well, no. My goal was to sponsor one a day, average, in the month.

Sponsor one a day. What other goals did you have? Well, the other goals are personal goals, which didn't really have anything to do with the Facebook chat. Oh, just in regards to the Facebook chat.

So, if you put yourself right there in the moment, what other goal did you have in regards to the Facebook chat for the month? Well, that was really… Well, that was really it, to sponsor 30 people using Facebook chat. That was the goal.

Exactly. Everything else was really the plan. Everything else was the plan. Or the activities.

The activities you did. To reach the goal. Okay. So, let's zoom forward.

So, I want you to go, and I want you to pick, with modeling, it always works best if we zero in on one specific day that stands out, or one specific time. And to be fair, if you're doing basically the same thing now that you were then, you can use one now. But if you can remember a specific time and day… A specific time and day during November, that would be really handy.

So, what I want you to do is I want you to think back to a time when it's like, it's time to do your Facebook chat for the day. Tell me a little bit about how you structure that. Do you structure that like in the morning, or the evening, or do you do it all throughout the day? Pretty much from the morning through dinner time.

From the morning. With breaks in between for lunch and breaks. So, from morning, meaning from like… From, say, 9 a.m.

to 4 p.m. To 5.30 p.m. To 5.30 p.m. Okay.

So, from 9 in the morning, so there you are at 9 in the morning. And again, what triggers you that tells you it's time to do your Facebook chat? Is it something that you've scheduled out, or is it something that, yeah, you've… Yes.

Yeah, you've scheduled it out. That's right. So, you've got it scheduled out. You show up to your office.

You're sitting in front of your laptop or your computer. And in the moment of doing a chat, and I want you to put, again, put yourself in a specific time when you're there getting ready to chat with someone. Whether it was this morning or whether it was back in November. And just ask yourself, in regards to sitting down with Facebook, what's your primary goal in being there?

To identify people who have commented, liked, or shared my posts. So, identify people who commented, liked, or shared. Right. Okay.

And I'm going to ask you a few times, and there's a good chance that you might blank out when I'm asking you this. Because I'm going to ask it like five times. Five times, probably. Maybe more.

So, there you are. You're about ready to chat. What other goal do you have? And I want you to go to a specific time.

So, if you like chatting earlier today, go back into when you're chatting earlier today. Just think, what other goal do I have here as I'm getting ready to talk to these people who've liked, commented, and shared? I want to identify someone who is willing to chat back and forth with me that has the time to do it right on the spot when I'm prepared to chat with them. Okay.

So, you want to chat with somebody right on the spot? Right. What other goals do you have there? So, there you are.

You're sitting in front of the computer. You've identified the people who've liked, commented, and shared. You've also identified the people who can chat with you right on the spot. What other goals do you have?

Again, it's more activity related. I just want to make sure that my Messenger is open in one tab, my personal Facebook profile is open in another tab. And my homepage is open in a third tab. So, I have Facebook open in three different tabs when I'm chatting.

So, getting myself set up, I want to be prepared to navigate easily and instantly while I'm chatting. Okay. So, you want to be prepared to navigate while you're chatting, which is a goal. And then, we have a little bit of operations.

So, in the geo, we're looking at goals, evidence, and operations, usually in that order. And I know that Kevin has got a real list. He's got a real detailed set of operations. We're going to make sure he has time to teach those, whether now or later.

But the goal is that you want to be prepared to navigate quickly. That's correct. Okay. And efficiently, because I'm guessing that you're probably going to be talking to more than one person at a time.

That's right. Yeah. Okay. So, what's another one of your…

So, if you're putting yourself there, there you are at your computer. And think back to this morning or back to November, if you can, and just put yourself right there. You're getting ready to chat. What other goals do you have?

Yeah. You do have me at a loss of words. Good. Step into the blank spot for a minute.

This is where we want you. Yeah. This is oftentimes where unconscious goals will come up to the surface. So, what are you hoping for?

There you are. You're getting ready. Think about… And it'd be really helpful if you…

I'm looking… I'm hoping that someone is dissatisfied enough or has a problem or a challenge in their life enough to open up to me. As I ask them questions, I'm looking for that kind of a person who has the time to speak with me right then and there, but are ready, willing, and able to open up to me as I ask them questions regarding themselves on the chat so that I can lead that conversation. I'm looking for somebody that'll allow me to lead the conversation with questions.

Okay. Hang on. So, we actually got a couple of goals right there. And I just want to restate them just to make it really clear.

Right? So, you want to lead them. So, you're looking for someone who is dissatisfied. You're looking for someone to ask questions to.

You're not looking to spam them, for example. No. Right? And you're also looking for someone who will be led.

Right. I'm looking for someone who's open to engagement. Open to engagement. In conversation with me.

So, you're looking for someone who's open to engagement and open to conversation. So, just for a minute, and I know that you may not have any other conscious goals, but just drop down into it. Think about someone specific that you were chatting with earlier today. And just ask yourself, what other goals did I have?

I'm looking for someone who's reaching out to me as well. Lots of people reach out to me. And it's either based upon a post that I've done that's a quote that's an inspirational quote or a post that I've done that's a video of either me or something else or a photo that I've posted that's motivational and inspirational. Because those are my primary posts, videos, quotes, and photos that are inspirational and motivational.

And what I'm looking for is I'm looking for that to trigger a conversation from someone to me first before I initiate a conversation with them. So, they've reached out to you whether it's through a like, comment, share, or maybe even a private message or anything. Right. Right?

So, you're looking for someone reaching out, right? Yes. So, you're looking for someone to give you a friend request that you didn't initiate or whatever. Right?

Yes. That too. Or what I'm guessing. Right?

Just based on what you just told me. So, you're looking for someone who's reaching out to you. Now let's, I'm just going to ask you one more time just because I want to know if there's anything unconsciously that's going through. Because these attitudes and these little goals that guide your behavior, they'll end up guiding what you do.

We'll almost be able to reverse engineer what you do if we know what your goals are. If that makes any sense. Right? Right.

So, just put yourself there. The last time you were chatting, even if it was earlier today, there you are and you're kind of looking at your Facebook and you're looking at all the people who've done everything they are. Maybe you've now engaged someone. In that moment, what's your goal?

Now that you've got, before you say your first hello or whatever you say. My goal is to help somebody. My goal is to find someone I can help. As an Empower Network affiliate, I'm empowered to help people with problems and challenges.

Right? And I want to find someone I can help. That's a major part inside of me that's actually a goal. Is to help someone.

Because they need help. People need help. And we are their helper. I am their helper.

And so are all the other affiliates that are out there. We are people's helpers. We can help solve the problems of finances and time. Right?

And I'm looking for people that need some help with their finances and time. Okay. So you're looking for people with finances and time. So I want you to think about somebody specific.

If it helps you. Don't show us a chat window because we don't want you to expose your chat or anything. But open your chat window so you can look at it. And I want you to look at a specific conversation that you had.

So it kind of jogs your memory. Okay. I need to open. Yeah, it's fine.

Take a minute. Yeah. And as I look for this, what is it that you want me to find? Really, what I want you to do is I want you to remember the conversation.

I want you to put yourself right in the moment where you started the conversation. I want you to ask yourself, now that I'm starting the conversation with this person, what other goals might I have for this conversation? And just by looking at the chat, I want you to just kind of jog your memory of a specific situation. And I actually want you to look at about three by the time we're done.

I just want to make sure I've got all your unconscious goals all up and out before we move on to the next phase of the process. So you're at the beginning of the conversation. Okay. And I just want you to just put yourself right there.

You're looking at the chat. We took a little pause there with the video so that he could do that. And what I want you to do just mindset-wise, just remember, you're talking to this person. What is your goal specifically with this person?

First off, it might be helpful if you remember, I don't know if you remember like where you found him. Was it like a like comment? Well, I have it right here. I can let you know here.

Yeah. I said I noticed. You liked my post, my dot post. We've been on each other's friends list for two years.

Tell me more about yourself. What do you do? Okay. So what's your goal right there?

That's what you said. What was your goal? My goal was to find out a little bit about this prospect. Okay.

So your goal is to find out. And in this moment, did you have any other goals with this prospect? Well, yeah. My goal was to find out.

My goal was to lead her in a conversation, to identify things about her occupation, her family, what she does for recreation, to engage in building the relationship, to see if there's an opportunity there to be able to prospect her. Right. So you're just kind of finding out about her to find out if there's a place where you can talk to her. So you're just trying to get her to open up and lead her in a conversation.

That's correct. That's correct. Okay. And is there any other goal that you had right there in that moment?

No, that was it because frankly, that's all we do. It's not complicated. Yeah. We're looking for people that have a problem.

We want to identify those problems, relate to them, not only find out about them, but I want to relate a little bit about myself at the same time so it doesn't look like I'm interrogating them. Right. And so if all I did was ask questions about, hey, what's your goal? Ask questions about, hey, what do you do for work?

Really? How long have you been there? Okay, great. What do you got for a family?

How many kids you got? I sound like I'm interrogating them. I want to engage. And when I ask them a question about an aspect of their life, whether it's recreation or what they do for work or their family, I'm going to share back to them a little bit about my family and recreation or whatever topic that I'm talking with them about.

So I want to match with them. That's not the right word. There's a word for it, and LP uses it, where we're both on the same page and might even be modeling. Well, actually, there are a couple of terms.

Matching is actually something that we do. That's where we say something similar back, for example. That's correct. Yeah.

Right. Right. Because, yeah. I want to diffuse the mind of the prospect and to neutralize, that's the right word, the mind of the prospect, and to let them know that I'm a real person, that I'm just as genuine as they are.

And my goal is, another goal, okay, this is coming up from my subconscious now, is to find a common ground with someone. Because, when you're on common ground. There's a lot more cooperation between the prospect and us when we're identifying things about themselves in their lives that we're trying to engage with and to connect with. Right.

So I heard a couple of things. I heard a goal to diffuse the mind of the prospect. Yeah, neutralize. Or to neutralize.

I'm sorry. That's the better word. So to neutralize the mind of the prospect. Right.

To let them know that you're a genuine person and to find common ground. Right. Now, you also kind of alluded to something earlier, and I just want to, but I'm not sure that I understood it right, so I'm going to just kind of toss it out and ask, is this a goal or is this not a goal? It almost sounds like you're, at the same time that you're connecting and diffusing and engaging and finding out about family, occupation, recreation, and all those things, that you're all, it almost seems like you're also sorting for whether or not they are engaging or not engaging.

Yes, and sorting as to whether or not they're even a prospect. Sorting. Or qualified for my business. One of my goals is to take on the posture of being a business owner, not a networker or an affiliate trying to get somebody in something.

My goal is to be a professional and to identify whether or not, I determine whether or not they're even qualified for me to engage. I'm going to give them my link. Okay. Unlike many people, that's their goal is to get them their link.

Get them your link. Get them the link. Quick, quick, quick. And then, you know, I get feedback.

Kevin, I talked to 24 people today, or I've talked to 24 people over the last few days, given them my video, and not one of them have signed up. And nine times out of ten, I discover it's because their posture is completely off base. Okay. What's your goal with your posture?

I mean, you said you want to be… The goal with my posture is to be a business owner, a CEO, interviewing for vice presidents. And that CEO just doesn't go out in the street and say, hey, I'm the CEO of a company. I'm looking for a couple of vice presidents.

You want to check out my company? Check it out here. Come on. Come on.

Check it out. No, you're kidding me. A CEO will tell his secretary to go contact monster.com or some job search site, get them 20 or 30 resumes. And then a screenshot.

And then a screen those resumes. And then maybe even interview some of those resumes before the president even breathes a word to those candidates who could possibly be a vice president for the company. And so my goal, another goal, is for me to interview people. I'm actually interviewing them in a unique fashion, because that is not an interview per se for a job, obviously.

Because we don't provide jobs. And it's not even an interview for a business opportunity. It's actually an interview to see if they have the right attitude, the right mindset, and the right physical qualifications before I decide that they're qualified for me to give them my link to take a look at the opportunity. So that is not your first goal.

Your first goal is to engage with someone who's engaged with you, establish a connection, and then once you've got the connection, then you're sorting for whether or not you're even going to send them anything. Right. Yeah. Exactly.

They have no idea. The great part about this, another goal of mine, is to not disclose verbally, and the only thing we have is text chat, to disclose that I'm actually discovering whether or not they're the right candidate for my job. I'm not disclosing the fact that I'm looking to see if they have a problem that I can help them solve. But that is what my goal is, is to find out a problem that another human being has that I might be able to help them solve by offering them my opportunity.

Okay. So the goal is connect. The goal is find a problem. The goal is sort and see if they're .

. . and there's a couple other little goals. Okay.

There's a couple goals in there, but it seems like those are the big ones. Is that right? That's right. Yeah.

That's correct. Okay. Is there anything else? I know.

I mean, I told you I'd ask you like a million times, right? I know. I know. And I'm on to you.

I know. Yeah. Well, the reason is when . .

. and this is one of the assumptions of modeling. If we get all of your beliefs, and your beliefs about this are as important as the actions you take. Yeah.

If I get your beliefs, your goals, your evidence, I'm telling you, nine times out of ten, I can reverse engineer the process. Good. Well, I want to ensure that the prospect can identify and see my sincerity in the fact that I care about people. One of my goals is to let people know that I care, even if I just met them.

And that can be accomplished by anybody, because if I can do it, like you said, it can be reverse engineered, and anyone else can do it. Yeah. You want people to know, and folks, you want people to know that you care. Yeah.

Well, my experience with people is that if somebody doesn't care, you sniff that out anyway. Right? Oh, easily. Easy.

It doesn't matter the technique you're using. It doesn't matter if you're using some NLP language pattern. It doesn't matter if you're doing whatever . .

. if there's not the heart behind it, and this is something we saw with Justin as well, with his copywriting. It's like, for him, it's all about inspiration, right? It's about downloading and inspiring.

Well, I don't have to do what Justin does to benefit from that. I can go, well, I want to really inspire people, and, you know, is my copy doing that? Right? Right.

And another goal is in my engagement, I want to be able to use what I've learned over the past 40 years on personal development and building relationships, and how to win friends and influence people. I want to be able to use the techniques that I've learned through tapes, cassettes back then, audios, videos, and events that I've attended. I want to use the principles and practices that I have learned in my conversations with the people that I'm chatting with, and I can easily spot those opportunities to use those principles based upon the fact that that's what I want to do during the course of the conversation with someone in a chat.

Sure. Yeah. Anything else? This is the last time I'm going to ask you.

I promise. Okay? I know I asked for a bunch. We got plenty here, I think, to work with.

Yeah. But anything else? Yeah, I want them to perceive that I'm focused. You want to perceive that they're focused.

No, I want them to perceive that I'm focused. They perceive that you're focused. Actually, I do have one more question. Okay.

Once you've sorted them, once you've gone through the sorting process, how do you know that it's time to share a link? Oh, that's easy. When a problem is unveiled either by the prospect or myself on a confirmation question based on what they're telling me or what I've been asking them, it's very easy. And this is the key.

It's never in the beginning or the middle of a chat. It's almost always near the end of the chat. Almost always. And identifying a problem is similar to what you just did with respect to identifying my goals.

And I don't do it in a fashion where I continually ask them about the problems. But I do that. Um, but I, I do identify their problems because most people have problems with their jobs. Most people have problems with their, uh, with, with family members and it may not be with them.

It may be about family, not, not a problem between them and their, you know, family member. That's what I'm not talking about. I'm talking about somebody who's got a problem, um, in their family and, uh, someone almost always has a problem with time and money when we talk about, um, recreation, uh, and money. And I use an acronym, um, to keep myself on track.

And I always mix up that acronym to keep myself on track in my course of the conversation. So that's another one of my goals is to use my acronym to keep my conversation on track with that prospect. What's the acronym? The acronym is form.

You must have form. And again, old school, uh, family, occupation, recreation, and money slash message. And I don't always go, okay, let's see if, let's talk about their family first. Okay.

Oh, let's talk about their occupation. I mix them up. Most of the time I talk about their job first. Right.

What do you do? Tell me about yourself. What do you do? And, um, and then I, I ask further questions about that.

And when, when they tell me what they do, I tell them what I do, but I don't want to get into that. Because that's the operations. Um, but, uh, for the, the, the, the goal is to keep myself on track with no matter what order it is. It could be R O F M.

It could be, uh, O M F R, you know? Uh, but as long as I use form, the acronym, uh, during that course of conversation, then I'm on track with that prospect. So that's a goal I did not talk about. Uh, that's huge.

That was in my subconscious sitting there. And I was in, and it's a quite obvious. Um, it's one of also the, it's not only the major reason why I'm, I'm very successful when I chat, but it's also one of the major reasons why people fail when they chat is they don't have any structure precisely and they don't understand. Um, and this hopefully will help people understand, um, the importance of building that relationship form builds the relationship.

And, um, once someone has that relationship of knowing you and liking you, the trust factor, we've talked about it a thousand times, you know, like, and trust when you send broadcast emails to your list, they're getting to know you like you and trust you, especially if you're sending them value. Um, or if you're doing a value, uh, one minute video in your PPC, it's the same thing. People start to like you. Uh, they know you, they like you and they begin to trust you.

That same principle applies when you start to trust them. So if you're using form when chatting, if you give, if you try to offer them your link way too soon in the process of getting them to know you and like you, they may say, yeah, send me the link, but they're not going to not only watch, not watch the video, but they're going to say no to you and even lie to you and say, yeah, I watched it, but it's not for me. Um, and I've experienced that just countless times, not only with myself in the past before I got real good at this, but with others who I'm working with.

Well, in a minute, I want to come back. I want to come back around and if we have time for it now, I want to come back around. I want to, I want to talk about the strategy piece that you've got running that tells you that it's time to send a link because I think that is a piece that, cause probably a lot of people have dabbled in Facebook chat, probably most, at least by my experience, at least once a day I get somebody who spams me a link, right? At least.

Um, and, um, some days I'll get five or six people who just say like, Hey, I just joined a company, check out my link. Or, or I'll get someone who will say something like, uh, when I got yesterday, there's a gal, young gal. She looked like she's about 21 real nice. I mean, her inner profile looked reasonable.

So I accepted her as a friend. Very first question out of her mind is, have you heard of NZ? I still don't know what NZ is, right? Somebody else on here probably does.

I said, no. I mean, there's no hello. There's no, how you doing? Just, Hey, have you heard of NZ?

I said, nope. And she said, want my link? And I said, nope. Right.

And so I know that you, as a successful Facebook, chatter know that there's a better way to do that. We're going to get to that here in a, actually tell you what, let's zoom forward. Even though this is out of order. Um, I want to get to this just to make sure we have time for it.

Cause I think this is going to be a key piece for people. Let's go to that quick, quick, quick question. Anything. Uh, do you want me to fix my lighting?

Cause it's now getting dark out. Oh yeah. Fix your lighting. Do what you gotta do.

Let me just, let me just, uh, there, I think that might, might be a little better. There might be a little, and you and me have the same problem that we both get into, but we're going to get to that later on, but I'm going to, I'm going to get to that later on. Same problem that we both get the little white spot in the middle of the forehead. And that's the, that's the grace on the door behind me to see that.

Oh, it's fine. We'll be fine. Okay. Well, this is better though.

Yeah, that's much better. So, um, let's go to this strategy piece. So you've, let's say that you've made your connection and we'll talk about how here in a minute, you've made the connection you've, um, through form, you've, you found a problem. You have a desire to help the person is sending off the right signals.

How do you know it's time to send a link? Okay. Well, you know, that involves the actual, uh, it would not do it justice. If I said, this is when you give them the link, I literally need to go through a process to let you know when it is time to give them a link, excuse me, by actually referring to an actual chat without disclosing names.

Perfect. If you could go to a chat and again, if we need to pause the video. Oh, you're ready. Okay.

Okay. Rock and roll. So, um, Hey, I noticed you liked my dot post. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. We've been on each other's friends list for a couple of years. Tell me about yourself.

What do you do? Well, my job is currently driving a school bus for special needs children. I do Reiki energy work and massage as well as volunteer quite a bit for the kids and disability sport program, as well as Smith fest events. I'm volunteering at event tonight in Lowell, registering a VIP for a weekend festival.

I've had many trials and tributes to overcoming cancers and seeing the white on paper you posted and, uh, she said that my daughter goes to college in Kentucky. I see this is where you live. So she asked me a question. I love it.

I said, Louisville. Yes. Wow. You have quite a life.

She said, I certainly do enjoying each day to the fullest and always striving to try new things within reason. I said, that's great. You know, I was thinking myself today, I have almost 5,000 friends in Facebook. And at the time it was more than 59,000 followers.

I have 63,000 followers now. And it's only been two and a half. Months since this conversation, uh, it would be nice to get to know more people. I said, she said, I enjoy your posts, but I don't know exactly what you do as well.

I said, well, you know, I used to work for a living until 2008. I was a call center consultant working 65 hours a week. She said, and now, and here's how I answered that. I said, now my wife and I personally coach one-on-one people who like to earn money from home.

I don't know whatever your role is. I know how to get my own home, but I have to do it online. Tell me more about your right key energy work. Cause that's sort of a palm healing therapy.

Um, God's power of life force energy all in one. I redirected the conversation when she asked me about me. So a lot of people would have taken that as bait and given it and given a link right there. Right there is where the biggest problem that people have, oh, oh, she wants to know what I do.

You know? Right. That president looking for vice presidents. Not time yet.

Not time yet. more about her work um about 12 lines of text i waited for her to finish typing right okay see that's a dale carnegie principle that i was able to act upon because i discovered that i could use a principle called become genuinely interested in other people that's dale carnegie 101 folks yeah the moment they show interest in you answer it but ask them a back a question about her and she went into well i'm a reiki two certified i help move blocked energy for clients i've been able to help family friends and clients feel better she's loving this she's telling me all about it i'm allowing them to be more open to other healing modalities i was honestly nervous about it but i didn't use my gift after an incident that occurred in my brother's attempt to commit suicide when he was in a coma and when i talked to him and placed my hand on his forehead and and and his hand and he started choking and set all the alarms off on the machines they're nurses asked me to leave the room and the next day while at church which is where i took my class i was attuned to the reiki energy i realized that possibly my reiki energy was moving energy in him and when i came out of church my mom told me my brother came out of this coma and i was a bit rattled over this and it took some time for me to embrace it but since then i've become a certified to a level two which allows me to heal from a distance which again has helped quite a few people when i have their permission to help them it's a blessing from god i'll go to church where god's the ultimate healer and i turn uh in turn help him and i and i replied with after that long dissertation in all his glory and grace god bless you for helping your brother i'm grateful she said thank you and so i said how is everything else in your busy life and so i i changed state for a minute and said you know how are you being are you being affected by what's happening with the economy she said i don't pay attention to the economy i feel as long as i'm forward spiritually educationally creating positive relationships i'm good and if you're asking do i want to know how to how to create more time money and freedom well i'm always interested to learn and of course kevin didn't jump on her for that like most people would have right i said good answer i said actually i was hoping you would say something like that i want to pause you you're right here because there's a this is part of your qualification process you didn't jump on her that's right but there's something in your mind there's a strategy piece that like the brand new guy isn't getting again what's the strategy right there when she goes you know yes i i mean she's almost leaping at you right you know it's what it feels like you know um you know and like you know please give me your link is what a newbie would hear but like what is in your mind strategy wise that keeps you from taking that bait well here's one you will gather when you go fishing you don't push fish away you don't push fish away you don't push fish away you don't push fish away you don't push fish away you pull fish yeah if i push it's not going to work when someone shows interest in and even a spark of interest in what i do i take it away from them i don't know if you'd be interested in what i do the moment they said hey what do you do well i don't know if you'd be interested in what i do i don't know if you'd even qualify for what i do i you know i'm not even sure in fact i don't i so my strategy is to use posture of takeaway i call it takeaway the minute they show interest take it away folks it works it works so i said you know good answer i'm hoping she said you know i've been a lot around the block a few times with a few entrepreneurial endeavors i said really like what see i asked a question the person who asked the question is in control right yeah and so see i just did it you answered you said right yeah okay what power i mean isn't it wouldn't it couldn't it don't you agree isn't that true all these questions are keeping control of the conversation aren't they and that's getting into technique but i learned that from tom hopkins university sure uh didn't i no uh so anyway she said i'm not trying to put time into the internet marketing though is that what you teach and i said yes that too what have you done in your entrepreneurial endeavors i've got back to it you turned i asked her again like what what have you done she said well i've been a party light representative and uh market america a phone company which i already forgot the name getting the people to switch their company to i've been in melaleuca hmm currently got offered a position to sell life insurance but need to pass a test to be an agent massage therapist also i said let me ask you why did you try those different things in the first place now there's a reason for me to ask her that isn't it because i want to get to her core value i want to know why she's looking i said first of all i said let me ask you why did you try those different things in the first place and incidentally it's refreshing to chat with someone who puts god first and is well versed simultaneously so again um i was hearty in my approbation and lavish in my praise sure folks that's another line sentence principle that stands the ages from dale carnegie's how to win friends and influence people so get the book i've referred to it at least twice because what are we doing here we're winning friends and influencing people is and that's what we're doing in empower network aren't we she said my massages with reiki allow extra money thank you and i said you're welcome um she says i like people i like helping and healing i'm positive i have three girls divorce divorced for about 15 years.

I have a chosen lifestyle to accommodate my family with one daughter who has disabilities as well as looking for ways to create more money, she said. And I said, my wife and I love people too. Our daughter has autism and she's our driving force and the reason we help other people. So what did I do there?

I just matched with her. You matched her at the level of values. We're aligned now. And so I wouldn't have been aligned had I continued that conversation and posted my link way back earlier in the conversation.

She said, so I tried other things to see which is personally fulfilling. I hope to know that there's more to learn and grow from. And here it is. This is the point where I was ready to give her a link because we were aligned.

And that's the answer to your question. Kevin, when is it that you would actually offer giving the link, right? Isn't that what you asked me before? Okay.

And it's right here. And here's how I did it. Well, hang on. I want to, I want to actually, before you tell us how you did it, because we want to get there.

I want to, I want the strategy piece here because your, your strategy is you share the link when you know that you're aligned. Right. Okay. Now, again, a brand new guy isn't going to necessarily know when he's aligned, but how does Kevin Sousa realize that he's aligned?

What are you listening for or looking for or what's the, what's the evidence? And this is an evidence question. Oh, it's so easy folks. F O R M.

When you've covered F O R M and you've uncovered your heart at the same time and you've uncovered their heart at the same time so that you're aligned. Yeah. F O R M. You talked about family, occupation, recreation, message, money.

Okay. She talked more about money. I did. Right.

Okay. I didn't have to ask her many questions about that. It was her that was, and that's how sometimes the course of conversation will go. Now that I know I've covered F O R M, which are the basics and I've uncovered my heart and uncovered hers.

Now we're completely aligned. How did you know? That's the strategy. How did you know that your heart was uncovered and how did you know that hers was uncovered?

Because we both confirmed with each other that. And what was it? Read, read the piece in the text that told you that your hearts were aligned. Cause I want to slow this piece down for people.

Okay. I'm going to back up. Yeah, back up. My heart started aligning when I started using the Dale Carnegie techniques of now, you know, the word technique, what is the technique?

It's, it's not really a technique, but that's how it's defined. Right. Becoming genuinely interested in someone else. You see folks, the world, does not have people who praise them every day.

Right. And when someone does, and it's genuine and sincere, they're attracted to you. Yeah. When you praise them, that's one point.

And we both talked about God a little bit. Okay. Okay. And when she said, it's a blessing from God and he's the ultimate healer.

And I, in turn help him. I said, in all his glory and grace, God bless you for helping your brother. She said, I'm grateful. Thank you.

There's a, there's a, there's a linking, um, hearts opening moment. Right. Yeah. In that conversation.

And then when, um, uh, let's see when she said. So it's not just when you're matching her values, it's when you're hearing a confirmation back from her. Correct. Right.

So if you matched and she said, no, that's not quite right. You'd say there's no, no heart alignment there. Um, right. But if you say, God bless you for healing your brother.

And she says, thank you. It's a true blessing. You, you, you, you, you're starting to know that something's happening. She referred to God before I did.

No, of course. Of course. And so I just, you know, confirmed that. And then she reconfirmed it.

And that's like tying a knot. Hey, we got a good relationship here. I know you have a good heart now. Granted she's known me for two years.

I did not know her at all. Right. I never chatted with her, but she's known me because she has seen my motivational and inspirational posts and Facebook for years. That's why she stayed following me.

Right. Okay. And so, um, so we're, we're at the point where now I'm offering her, uh, the opportunity to take a look at the business. Well, I, I want to, I want to pause for a minute here just to make sure I'm slowing it down.

So you saw her heart starting to open up and then you confirmed it. You, you just made a comment and she just, she confirms it back, but she did that more than just once. She did that. She did that what?

Two or three times before. Do you always wait two or three times or do you? Yeah. Uh, yes and no.

Yes and no. Here's why I say that every chat's different. Of course it is. Every chat is dynamic and it takes time for, uh, someone to, yes, you can reverse engineer what I'm teaching.

Yeah. But there's one piece that needs the human heart, the human soul, the humanity and common sense. Well, yeah, as Mark Twain said, uh, the only common thing about common sense is that it's not so common or something like that. Right.

All of us. But here, I think that common sense is also something that we learned through experience, because I'm guessing that this has been a discovery process for you over time. Yes. And you know, you, you also discovered too that, um, when you're prospecting with someone, folks, they are not the last prospect on, on the planet Earth.

Right. Okay. And that's one of the reasons why you're giving them the link too soon. Not only because they expressed a remote shred of interest, but because of the fact that you actually subconsciously think that, oh, I finally got a prospect.

Yeah. Guess what? There are millions of people in this world. Don't think that this one is the, oh, I finally got somebody again!

Oh, you finally… oh! All right. Oh, you finally got somebody again!

Oh, you finally got somebody again! Oh, you finally got somebody It's not the end, it's the beginning, folks. It's the beginning. And so change your perception that this is not the last prospect on the planet, because then your desperation takes over, and you want to get that link into their hands as fast as possible, hoping that you'll be blessed with another person like this one soon.

Yeah. Okay? We are in control. You and I are in control.

We are in control of the process. The process is not in control of us. Oh, I hope this works. No.

I hope I work today. Right. So anyway, I didn't mean to digress. No, it's okay.

But again, slowing it down, so you wait for this one. You match at the level of values. Values are a belief about what's important. So if she says, you know, healing people and helping is really important, and you say, wow, yeah, healing and helping, is really important for me, and she says, wow, that's right, or whatever.

It's like, okay, there's one connection, but oftentimes, whether or not you're doing it all the time, at least sometimes, you're waiting for two or three confirmations that you've got some kind of alignment going on. Right. Right? Not always, but with this one, you did.

That's right. Yeah. Okay? And so…

And then lead us up right to the sharing of the link. Okay, so I'll just back up a couple of sentences. She said, I said, my wife and I love people, too. Our daughter…

Who has autism as our driving force and the reason we help other people. So working, she said, working with a school schedule has been important to allow me to be with them on times off with her children. I did home care for all the years growing up and now drive the bus, but it does not make for great money in the end of the day. Right.

I said, I hear you, but it must feel great to be involved with helping. So I've tried other things to see what's personally fulfilling and hope to know that there is more to learn and grow from. And this is where I said, Karen, dot, dot, dot. And she went, LOL, yes.

It was almost as if we were physically having the conversation. And that's how powerful heart matching is. Heart matching. Where do you feel that in your body?

I mean, you're gesturing… My entire body, from head to toe. Okay. Because when I said, Karen, dot, dot, dot, and she said…

I said, yes, LOL. She knew what was coming. Right. So, of course, she did.

Now, hang on, though. This is an important strategy piece. So if I'm brand new, one of the things I'm waiting for is I'm waiting for some sort… You're using your body as like an antenna for this.

That's correct. And when you're feeling almost like… And you said something interesting. I'm going to paraphrase it.

It's not exactly what you said. Somebody's watching the video to catch you, but I was taking notes. You said, like, I feel it with my whole body. Right?

It's like… And then it's like she… It's like we're right there or something like that. So you're literally feeling like you're in the room with her.

Right. We're physically having the conversation. Physically. Chatting.

So part of your strategy for sharing a link is waiting until you feel the connection and that you're physically having it in that you're, like, feeling it in your… Does that mean you're feeling it in your body? Or what does that mean exactly? Yes.

It means that there's a smile on my face. At this point in the conversation. Yeah. That's how I'm…

You know, I'm all alone. There's nobody in the room with me, but there's a smile on my face while I'm chatting online. Come on. I mean, that's physical because I could feel her smile, too.

Yeah. And by the way, as you went into it, I just want to point out you physically smiled and your color changed in your face. Right? Yeah.

You're remembering it, right? But this is an important thing. Right? This is the part of the strategy that…

I mean, maybe you've taught this before, but it's like… This is part of your strategy. You know when it's time to share a link. You don't share a link even if you've matched two or three times.

That's not your criteria. Your criteria is, I feel it. I am having a physical conversation now with this person. And that's your measurement of the connection.

And then it's, boom, time to share the link. Is that about right? Yeah. Were you consciously aware of that or not?

Well, yes. Both. It's really… I can't…

It's hard to describe, but it's both conscious and unconscious. It just envelops my whole being. Yeah. When you just know.

And then you know you know. And you know they know. And they can almost feel it. And they know you know.

It's just awesome. It's just awesome because the same thing happens when you prospect in person because I use the same principles and practices in person face-to-face as I do online. Sure. I don't change what I do.

Why? What I do works because it's… It's all about them. Sure.

It's not all about me. You know, you will give the link… You will be able to give links to people on a virtually unlimited basis when it becomes all about them. Right.

Yeah. You really will. Yeah. Okay.

So, you know what? That feels a lot better than getting an email telling me I have a new lead. That feels a lot better telling me that I have someone who has watched my video you know, electronically. You cannot replace that.

There will be arguments of, well, I get at least 100 or 200 people a day or whatever get notifications and so I kind of have that same feeling. Nope. You cannot have that same feeling unless you're engaged with that prospect. Right.

Period. It's not the same. So, you use your body to notice if there's real connection. And if there's not, if you're going like, if you're still hesitant, no link.

No link, no love, nothing. And you don't want them around. No. Not yet.

Not till there's a connection. Not now. Maybe later. I don't know.

Maybe later. You know? Yeah. So, planning seasons.

I'm still sorting. You're sorting. You're sorting. You're sorting even through the end of the conversation and then when you follow up with them again in the future.

Well, we're going to talk about that here in a little bit. And you're doing awesome. I appreciate it. I know I'm interrupting a lot, but I'm trying to pull out as much, as much value as I can here.

Please do. Yeah. And then we'll give you a time and a place where you can just teach and just give us all the structure of everything that you know how to do because I know you've got that lined out like a champ. Incidentally, I have good news.

Yeah. I have on document this entire chat without her name. Oh, fantastic. We'd love to have that.

Just so you know. Well, we'd love to have that in the back. Yeah, in the back office so that people can take a look at it and study it again because it's part of that is studying. You can go, wait a minute.

Why didn't he do it here? Why didn't he do it here? And noticing, and not saying I'm going to use these exact words or this exact phrase, but kind of look at his strategy to see how he's lining this up. But let's go back.

So there you are. And you feel this whole body connection with the person. And it's time to drop the link. So you go.

So I said, Karen, she said, LOL, yes. I said, I have a link that leads you to a video that I recorded personally, which explains, this is the personal coaching my wife and I provide. Would you like to see what we do? And she said, I am curious.

And I said, which means? You see, I still didn't. She said, yes. Okay.

I want a yes. I am curious is not a yes, folks. Don't give her the link there. You'll blow it.

I still didn't give her the link. I said, which means? And that came from the Sandler Sales Institute. I learned that technique in principle from Sandler.

You never read the mind of the prospect, ever. Don't ever read their minds. I am curious does not mean I'm interested. Yes does.

Okay. So when I said, which means? She said, yes. I dropped her the link.

I said, let's follow up. You're going to watch it now, right? So hang on. So which link did you send her?

This is to a personal video that you cut? Yeah, a bridge, a bridge of me. A bridge of you. And does the bridge go into the sales video or?

Yeah, the bridge leads them to the Empower Network video. Now at that time, that particular one that I was using, that particular funnel. So a bridge of me, which leads them to the, the Empower Network video. To the Empower Network video.

That's correct. Okay. And so first the bridge of me, and there's a link on that page that leads them. It's a lead capture page, which takes them to my bridge page.

Which leads them to the Empower Network sales video. Okay. It's a lead capture page that leads to the bridge, that leads to the bridge video that leads to the sales video. Right.

Yep. Got it. And, um, and so what's, and then what's your followup process like? So there you go.

And you take her from. Yeah. Well, she said, sound great. And I said, I'll be, I'll be back after lunch.

Uh, it's been really great chatting with you, Karen. She said, perfect. Thank you for the interest as well. And I said, God is good.

And she said, amen, and I'm signing in ready for more information. Uh, I'm at the site. And so she literally, when I gave her the link said I'm at the site and she said, and I'm signed up. This was hang on.

Let me look at the time. Excuse me, 20, actually less than 20. It was that night that, excuse me, that afternoon. Okay.

I talked to her in the morning. Let me look at the. Okay. So the time that I started the conversation with her real quick, oh, it was at 10 36 AM, 10 36 AM and let's go down to where she was because we've obviously chatted since then at 12 55 PM, one o'clock.

So I started the conversation at 10 30 and by one o'clock she said, I'm signed up, ready for more information. What do I do? I said, great, let's talk and posted my phone number and gave her the startup, which of course, what's the fast start videos and blah, blah, blah, blah. So she had, she had, she purchased by then or she, yeah, she, she, she said, um, I'm signed up ready for more information.

Okay. Gotcha. Gotcha. Gotcha.

I missed that. So she, she purchased within 10 30, 11 30, 12 30, within two and a half hours from the chat she was in. Right. And so she's in, she's signed up.

And then you. You tell her to go through the fast start videos and do you do any, and this isn't a new member orientation thing. We're going to go through that later with somebody else. Um, but that, that's basically where you got her from there, right?

Correct. Okay. So, um, let's, let's go back. I want to, I want to pull out a couple of key pieces and I've got about, I think I've got about, let me just check my clock here real quick.

I think I've got about up, up to about 19 minutes, but then I got to go pretty much right at the top of the hour here. So just let me take a quick peek at that. Yeah. I'm gonna have to go at five o'clock my time.

It's about 4 41 right now. Okay. So, um, and by the way, I'm learning here, I've taken reams of notes and I hope if you're watching this, that you've also learned from Kevin and remember, we're going to let him teach on two things in separate videos and where he's just going to be walking you through the, how he's done this. But remember your goals necessarily define your actions.

You change now, probably not all of his goals are as important as the other, but there's going to be a cut. And that's what we're going to go and identify right now. Which are the key goals that he has, because his goals going into the chat are going to determine what he's looking for and how he does it. And if we can match his goals and if we can match his evidence for how he does things, there's a good chance we're going to start doing things in a similar fashion.

We're still going to have to go through the learning curve because Kevin's got a lot of experience doing this, but it's going to majorly shortcut that learning curve for us just by knowing what to look for and how to know that we got it. I think this piece about using the body as an antenna. That's not something that I would have imagined on my own. So I just, for me, that was a big sharing piece.

And that's something that I got some major value out of, but, and I like the way that describes heart matching and you might describe it differently, but you'll know what he's talking about when you get there and you feed, start to feel something opening up. Right. Um, just like I might not feel inspiration just because, you know, Justin's probably the last video that you guys watched. I don't necessarily feel inspiration in the same way that Justin feels it, but I know that when I start to feel inspired, I'm in a good place.

To write and I'm in a good place to speak and I'm in a good place to produce my content, right? Even if I'm not using the same marketing strategy, right? Um, cause that heart space, you can't fake that. You get that.

That's, that's big, that's big time, big time, uh, value there. So out of all the goals, I'm just going to read them back real fast. And I want you to tell me when we get like one, one of the major ones and I want you to go flag that one. Okay.

That one's important. Okay. And I want to grab like the top three goals and we're going to kind of break those down a little bit into evidence. And, and maybe even what you do with them in the next couple minutes.

Is that all right? Yeah. Okay. So, um, um, going down, uh, your goal to sponsor one a day.

How important was that to your chat process? No, that was my goal for my action. So we won't flag that one. Okay.

Um, identify someone, identify comments, likes, or shares. Yeah. Well, again, that's kind of finding prospects. Finding it.

So, yeah. That's not during the chat. Not during the chat. Um, identify someone who will chat with you right on the spot.

No, no. Keep going. Okay. Messenger.

Um, that's the process thing. I want to be prepared to get quickly. Um, I want someone to be, I want to find someone who's dissatisfied. Okay.

Yeah. That, that happens during the chat. So that would, that would be one, um, maybe a little red flag. A little flag.

Um, you want to, you want to be able to lead them. Um, you want to, uh, open the, you want someone who's open to conversation, someone who reaches out to you and, um, your goal is to help someone. Yeah. Help someone big, huge, big, huge one.

Okay. And, uh, find someone you can help specifically with finances and time, I think is what you said. Yeah. Okay.

Then we have, uh, find out about. Find out about the prospect is one of your goals leading in the conversation about around family, occupation, recreation, and money or message. Yeah. That, that's a big one.

Okay. Okay. So the form method, I think they call that, right? Yeah.

Is one of your main goals. You want to be able to relate to them. Um, you want to be able to engage them. Uh, your goal is to share back.

Your goal is to neutralize the mind. The prospect, your goal is to be a, um, to say that I am a genuine person, um, to find common ground, to sort whether they are a prospect for your business, um, to have the mindset. I am an owner. I am a professional, uh, to, to say that I, I am the business owner interviewing for a VP position.

Yeah. That mindset, that mindset. Those two kind of go together. Um, okay.

We'll just say that the same thing or similar. Yeah. Okay. And then that's another one to red flag.

Okay. Um, and then we've got to have a heart connection, which I would put as the goal. That's not how you said it. That's huge.

Yeah. Or the heart matching, right? Yeah. And we already talked about the evidence on that one.

Okay. And I think that's good. I think that gives us a few to look at. Is there any that we missed?

No, no, those are the important ones, huh? Again, I'm always curious, not that it matters one way or the other, but is there anything that was new in there that you hadn't explicitly taught before? No, actually, I've pretty much taught everything, but the way that you have, uh, interviewed me and able to bring out things that, um, are important to be covered when reverse engineering this whole process. Yeah.

It's interesting, isn't it? Um, yeah. And then when you teach it, it'll. It'll be very logical, sequential, and we'll have those videos up too.

And so if you prefer that style of learning, that'll be available to you. Um, yes. And then also just FYI, uh, when I give somebody a copy of this chat script, this actual chat script, uh, they don't get to experience what we have just put together here. No, they just read the script and they're not understanding the psychology behind every statement that we made in this chat.

Yeah. Uh, and. And I think it's really awesome that if someone looks at the script and, and watches this, you know, interview, they're going to really get exactly what to do when you're chatting with someone. Yeah.

And again, it won't keep you from making some dumb mistakes. Uh, let's be honest. Um, you, even, even now, Kevin, you have some chats that probably don't go that well. That's right.

Right. That, that is all well, yeah, we all will. Right. I know enough about that.

You know, people, people ask me, well, well, you're. You're, uh, uh, an, an expert NLP practitioner. Do you ever have a session that goes badly? Yeah.

It's the way that life works. Right. You know, do you ever make a mistake? Do you ever break rapport with someone?

Right. I'm pretty sure I did that with someone yesterday. You know, it's like you, you do the best you can. And if you make a mistake, you correct it, you learn from it, you move on.

Right. So let's go in. So of these goals, I've got just a few outlined here. Let's take a look at, um, and I got my notes turned around.

Um, we've got, you want someone to find someone who's dissatisfied. Your goal is to help someone you want to be able to lead the conversation. And you have this mindset of, I am an owner. I am a professional.

I'm interviewing a VP and then, um, and then to get the heart alignment. And we've already talked about the heart alignment. So of those goals, which is the first one that you want to break down? Um, or which one is most important.

Do you think to the whole process form? Because it keeps you on track with all of the above. Okay. Well, let's talk about form.

I want you to, to explicitly teach how you approach. This is more of an operations, uh, an operations question. So we're skipping the evidence, but, um, how do you approach the whole form thing? You talked a little bit about it earlier, how you just want to hit every point, but, um, you know, maybe think about a specific chat that you've had recently.

You don't have to go pull it up or anything, but just kind of think through how are you strategically approaching that as you're approaching the prospect? Okay. Well, you know, I can actually. You do a pseudo chat in my head to, to describe that.

Perfect. Okay. Yep. So, um, again, I begin the conversation with, um, a compliment about something.

Hey, thank you for liking my post or sharing my post or making a comment on my post. Uh, tell me more about yourself. What do you do? That's the first thing that I ask.

And of course that they could assume, I mean what they do for work, uh, which most of them do. And that's what I'm asking. And it's okay. That that's an almost an assumptive, um, on their, their part, find out what they do.

Well, I'm a carpenter. Really? How long have you been doing that? Oh, for 10 years, 10 years.

You must love it. I hate it. I always praise. You must love it.

I hate it. Why? You must have a good reason for that. Do you mind if I ask why?

Yeah, because I worked too many hours and I don't have much time. Oh, okay. Yeah. But obviously you stay.

Okay. If you stay with it, why do you stay with it in spite of that? So I dig a little bit about their occupation and I tell them, you know, I, I, what do you do? I teach people how to earn income online after I asked them what they do for a living, but I go right into my next question.

So married kids. Yeah. I got a wife and a couple of boys. Really?

How old? Oh, uh, 10 and 12. What are they like? Fifth, sixth grade.

Uh, one's in sixth grade ones and going to seventh grade. Oh, okay. Great. Uh, so what do you guys do for fun?

And, um, I might go right into recreation or depending on how the chat's going, uh, I might say, yeah, you know, I have one stepdaughter. Actually, she has autism. She's 18 years old. Love her to death.

She's taught me patients, uh, uh, because of her, I have more patients than a hospital. Sometimes I'll say that and I'll be funny, you know, and they'll, they'll chuckle. Ha ha. You know, um, and I spell patients correctly when I do that, but they still laugh because it's a play on words and, um, and then, uh, we'll get into, you know, so what do you do for fun with the boys when you're not working while we love to go camping in the summertime and in the wintertime, we all like to go bowling, you know, uh, great.

Now, how often do you go camping in the summertime? Well, maybe once, once a month or so. And, uh, and I'll, I'll. And I'll ask them, are you happy with that?

I mean, why don't you go more often than once a month if you love to do it? You see how I'm leading the conversation? Yeah. Um, obviously money and time is what's stopping them.

I want them to tell me that. They know, I know that's the reason, duh, but I'm not going to, well, why don't you spend more time with them going camping if you love to do it? Because I can't. Why is that?

Well, like I told you, my job. I got to work too many hours. Yeah, I know how you feel. I felt the same way.

I used feel, felt, found, feel, felt, found. I thought I know how you feel. I felt the same way when I had a job. I didn't really have much time or money to do anything I wanted to do in life, um, until I found what I do now.

But, um, why, why do when you go bowling, uh, during the, the colder months, how often do you do that? Are you in a league? Uh, no, I'm, I'm not in a league, but you know, we were thinking of maybe joining a league. Yeah.

That's, um, you know, maybe one night a week, right? Um, joining a bowling league, which means you'd have to make sure you're home from work on time for that. Isn't that true? Yeah, that's true.

Um, my wife works too. She's, uh, she doesn't have to, but she, she, my wife, uh, works for UPS. She's got two more years before she's fully vested for her retirement and she's insisting on staying on a job, even though she doesn't have to. But, um, does your wife work?

What, what does she do? Well, yeah, actually my wife's a part-time. Uh, nursing home, uh, gal. Oh, okay.

Well, how, how many, uh, does she work during the day or at night? No, no, during the day. Um, when our kids are in school. Okay.

Yeah. Great. Does she like that? Well, uh, yes and no.

Well, when you say yes and no, what does that mean? And I, again, I don't read their minds. I always ask them, what does that mean? Yes or no?

Well, yes, because it brings in extra money. No, because, well, you know, she'd rather be staying at home. Okay. Okay.

Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay.

Okay. I relate to that. Why doesn't she stay at home? Well, we need the extra money.

Well, you must have a good reason for needing extra money. Why is that? Now I'm starting to talk about things they want that they can't have with the current situation. Right?

Right. And so I'm sifting. I'm, I'm identifying whether or not they're a prospect for my business. And sometimes I'll end the chat abruptly right there.

Well, you know what? Gee, I have to run. Um, I tell you what. Uh, I'm enjoying this chat, man.

Let's, let's, let's talk again tomorrow. Some, sometime you're on Facebook, um, a lot, right? Yeah, I am. Okay, great.

Do you have messenger on your phone or do you wait till you get home again on Facebook? I always ask him that. There's a reason for that because, um, I have a little notepad next to me, uh, on my desk that I take little notes, John Smith, Facebook, mobile, both. Okay.

That's important folks, you know, we have a business to run. We need to know. So when I talk to John again, I'll say, are you on your phone or at home? Right.

And that way I know whether or not he's prepared to do. I don't want people to go watch my video from their phone. Interesting. I want them to watch it from their computer at home.

Okay. Now, some people may argue with that. Are you limiting yourself? Kevin?

No, that's my policy. That's the way you work. And I'm sticking to it. Yep.

Okay. So, I mean, because I'm talking to them, I'm not waiting for leads to come into my email from advertising that I spent thousands of dollars on or hundreds of dollars on or whatever. Okay. Yeah.

Um, that this is, this is different free advertising and free marketing is a different animal than, uh, paid paid advertising. Okay. Uh, it takes guts and courage a lot more to do what I do than it does. In fact, Kevin, I've asked you a couple times to give me a photo of what you do and it made me, I don't even want to make it public, but because I, you know, for the most part, the first thing I actually want to ask you is, Well, how does it go?

What do you do? How does it go? How do you do marketing? I'm hard.

I'm really good. Maybe they're even having success, but it's like the mental output to get there is a lot of energy. Well, you know, a couple of things. Okay.

Boy, am I glad you asked me that. I believe. I believe in my reason. My reason is why I get uncomfortable.

It's not uncomfortable when your reason is strong enough. It's only uncomfortable when your reason is not believed in and is weak. I hope this works. I hope I work today.

The only way I'm going to work today is to have my belief and to break through that wall of belief. I look at my reason. And I change my state. If I'm not in a state of belief, if I'm not in a state of belief, because of whatever happens, we have the years of life.

I call it the years of life. Right. And the years of life will take you out of your state just as quickly as the actions that you want to take to break that wall will bring you into the state that you want to be in. And so my heart says when I'm ready.

That I believe in my dream and my outcome. My outcome is already. Has already been manifested. That's how strong the belief is.

And when your outcome and belief is strong right here. You don't move heaven and earth to do whatever it takes. To make that happen. And you won't think of the process.

You'll think of the result. And when you think of the end result. It's so amazing how the words come to you, what to say and how to say it, and the inflection in your typing, by the way, typing has inflection, remember, Karen, yes, right, there's inflection in those words, folks, so don't think that typing doesn't have inflection because it does if your heart's in it and you believe that's the mindset that you need to make chat work for you when you believe in your goal. And you use some tips.

And you use some techniques like we taught, you cannot fail, you will just chat with the next person, and if that chat doesn't go well, you're going to go on to the next person, why, well, they have a goal to achieve, you have an outcome to live out, that's why, yeah, last question, what is your why, my why is freedom, if I were to say it in one word, is it a freedom from or a freedom to. Oh, it's both, freedom to and from, baby, you know, and you won't achieve freedom unless you help others achieve theirs, and so it's all encompassing, it's everything, it's inside and out, back and forward, up and down, freedom is not just a word, okay, without spending hours telling you all the whys, because I have more than one why, the biggest why is freedom.

Freedom. Freedom is the reason. Now, you did something interesting, and this is my last question, you did this, freedom, and you kind of marked it out with your hands, kind of like that, right, and you did this thing like you were looking at something, put yourself back there for a second. Okay.

What was the image that came to your mind? Peace. Yeah, what does that look like? Peace looks like standing in a field, watching birds flying by, trees in the background, water in the distance.

And a calmness, beautiful sunny day, maybe one or two spot of clouds for color and perspective, but freedom, to be able to walk, and run, and stand, and smile, and to give others that same feeling, is what freedom means. Freedom is a state of mind. Yeah. And so I appreciate you asking me how did that feel, and what does that look like to you, because freedom is a state of mind.

Yeah. There's a musical, by the way, there's a musical called Shenandoah that was put out back in the 70s, and that was one of the songs. The name of the song was Freedom is a State of Mind, and I'm dating myself, but I don't care. No, it's all right.

I don't care how old or young you are, freedom is an important thing, and that's why. Well, this is a good place to pause, I just wanted to say thank you, and again, give Kevin some, a shout out, you know, reach out to him, say hey, and let him know that you appreciate all the learning that you got from him. I just, I wanted to say, from my heart, Kevin, thank you, and I learned a few things that I can immediately go and apply to anything I'm doing, and that's super cool. I really appreciate you.

Thank you, I appreciate you. Thank you. Practicality dictates that everyone's results will vary. All unique and different.

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